free will

[Billyboy]

just curious if anyone belives in it, and the whys and why nots

[Pob]

Do I believe that I have the free will to choose to do the things I do?

Yes... I'm not sure that needs any reasoning... why would I not think that?

[Neil]

i believe in it because i don't believe in god controlling our every move according to some plan. but obviously our decisions are a product of a lot of factors, most of which are out of our control, so we can't have absolute free will.

we all have a set path though, no matter how in control of our decisions we are there's only one way our life is going to happen. unless we gain the ability to see the future that won't change

[Theikos]

i started typing a detailed explanation for why free will is bullshit but then I got lazy.

[Mitch]

yes, i believe in free will. mainly because i don't believe in there being any kind of higher power.

[Ro]

how could you not believe in free will? the things we do our by our own choices and decisions, no one else decides what im going to do or when im going to do it..

I barely beleive in god, so i definitely dont believe we all have some destiny or faith as to how our lives are going to turn out.

[Theikos]

where did this idea come from that the validity of free will depends on whether or not God or some higher power exists?

[Ro]

because a lot of people believe destiny/faith is decided by a higher power

[Mitch]

well either there's some kind of higher power or we have some pre-programmed route in life and our intelligence and our ability to reason and make choices is all just an illusion.

both of which seem hard to believe for me.

[Theikos]

and if you eliminate that higher power, you still haven't shown free will to be valid.

edit: ugh, all of you are so far out in left field on this. bleh where the fuck do i even start

[Mitch]

you've reduced the possible reasons for not having free will though.

[Ro]

you havent shown its invalid either, there is no real way to 'prove' it, all comes down to belief in my opinion

[Mitch]

and if you eliminate that higher power, you still haven't shown free will to be valid.

edit: ugh, all of you are so far out in left field on this. bleh where the fuck do i even start

i'd like to invite you to provide absolute proof we do not have free will.

[Theikos]

yea, that's not how that works.

[Neil]

bear in mind that we didn't choose our genetics, personality traits, upbringing etc. pretty much everything that factors into the deicisons we make is out of our control, so we don't really have free will

[Mitch]

yea, that's not how that works.

so you admit there is no clear right or wrong here?

what makes your opinion any more valid?

[Oasis]

I believe that we have free will to an extent, however a lot of our decisions are already made from life experiences, so when the time does come to make a certain decision we have been influenced upon our 'decision', without actually knowing we have been influenced to make that decision. Makes more sense in my head than it does here.

[Ro]

and if you eliminate that higher power, you still haven't shown free will to be valid.

edit: ugh, all of you are so far out in left field on this. bleh where the fuck do i even start

you say this like its a bad thing to believe in free will?

[Theikos]

every choice we ever make is based on the strongest desire at any given moment of choice. we ultimately have no control over our desires. if we don't have control over our desires, we don't have control over our choices.

[Ro]

every choice we ever make is based on the strongest desire at any given moment of choice. we ultimately have no control over our desires. if we don't have control over our desires, we don't have control over our choices.

not true for everyone. thats acting on impulse, whereas the other side would be to think it through. Like mitch said, there is no right or wrong answer here

[Oasis]

your mum was happy to sleep with me though...

[Ro]

Conor keep the shitty insults between you guys on the other thread?

[Pob]

not true for everyone. thats acting on impulse, whereas the other side would be to think it through. Like mitch said, there is no right or wrong answer here

I don't believe in free will because I think there is a small alien in our skulls controlling us from birth.

Trust me, there are wrong answers!

[Theikos]

no, it is true for everyone and to claim otherwise is sort of embarassing. every choice ever made by any human that ever existed was according to that particular person's strongest desire in the moment of choosing. That is an absolute, inviolable law of nature and if you don't even know THAT much when it comes to dealing with free will philosophically, then you should stop now and come back once you've got a grasp on it.

[Oasis]

yeah i will actually because i like billyboy, and im beggining to like you

[Billyboy]

well either there's some kind of higher power or we have some pre-programmed route in life and our intelligence and our ability to reason and make choices is all just an illusion.

both of which seem hard to believe for me.

genetics and environment has a pretty big influence on your behaviour, some would argue an interaction between the 2 is what determines your behaviour

pretty much everything in our universe is governed by cause and effect, why would people be any different?

[Ro]

i never stated to know free will philosophy, and if every arguement requires information on the philosophy of it, wheres the fun in that.. its just i dont think for myself that i act on whatever the strongest desire im feeling at the moment is. Just example, when im out, if someone really pisses me off and my strongest desire is to deck him, if i walk away, what about then? this isnt me trying to prove everything your saying wrong, im interested about this stuff now after what you said

edit-

yeah i will actually because i like billyboy, and im beggining to like you

your making me blush

[Theikos]

If you walk away, your desire to walk away prevailed over your desire to punch the guy so your desire to walk away was the strongest desire.

bleh. i'm tired, i want a beer, and i want a cig. continue this later.

[Ro]

so if someone was smart enough to walk away even though they would have loved nothing more than to kick the guys face in, thats desire?.. that may sound retarded i just think rational thinking is different than desire. maybe not, sorry

[Oasis]

I wanna furiously type insults to you Theikos about how much I dislike you and how much of a douche you are, however i choose not to because i wanna be sensible throughout the forum and prove i'm not always annoying. The fact you're willing to insult Laura in such a harsh way could be argued that you had a crap upbringing, and are regularly insulted, and it is from these different aspects of your life that you feel the need to do so to other people. You had the opportunity to not call Laura however you chose to do so, surely you could argue that you're not a douche but you did so because you've grew up to think that was right looool i dunno what im saying here im just blabbing. i started of thinking i had a point. then realised i dont